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Discussion Starter #1
another brilliant idea!

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/03/10/veterans.health.insurance/index.html

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Veterans Affairs Secretary Eric Shinseki confirmed Tuesday that the Obama administration is considering a controversial plan to make veterans pay for treatment of service-related injuries with private insurance.


Lawmakers say they'd reject a proposal to make veterans pay for treatment of war wounds with private insurance.

But the proposal would be "dead on arrival" if it's sent to Congress, Sen. Patty Murray, D-Washington, said.

Murray used that blunt terminology when she told Shinseki that the idea would not be acceptable and would be rejected if formally proposed. Her remarks came during a hearing before the Senate Committee on Veterans Affairs about the 2010 budget.

No official proposal to create such a program has been announced publicly, but veterans groups wrote a pre-emptive letter last week to President Obama voicing their opposition to the idea after hearing the plan was under consideration.

The groups also cited an increase in "third-party collections" estimated in the 2010 budget proposal -- something they said could be achieved only if the Veterans Administration started billing for service-related injuries.

Asked about the proposal, Shinseki said it was under "consideration."

"A final decision hasn't been made yet," he said.

Currently, veterans' private insurance is charged only when they receive health care from the VA for medical issues that are not related to service injuries, like getting the flu.

Charging for service-related injuries would violate "a sacred trust," Veterans of Foreign Wars spokesman Joe Davis said. Davis said the move would risk private health care for veterans and their families by potentially maxing out benefits paying for costly war injury treatments.


A second senator, North Carolina Republican Richard Burr, said he agreed that the idea should not go forward.

"I think you will give that up" as a revenue stream if it is included in this April's budget, Burr said.

Murray said she'd already discussed her concerns with the secretary the previous week.

"I believe that veterans with service-connected injuries have already paid by putting their lives on the line," Murray said in her remarks. "I don't think we should nickel and dime them for their care."

Eleven of the most prominent veterans organizations have been lobbying Congress to oppose the idea. In the letter sent last week to the president, the groups warned that the idea "is wholly unacceptable and a total abrogation of our government's moral and legal responsibility to the men and women who have sacrificed so much."

The groups included The American Legion, Disabled American Veterans, Military Order of the Purple Heart, Veterans of Foreign Wars of the United States, and Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America.

At the time, a White House spokesman would neither confirm nor deny the option was being considered.
 

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I posted this way back in March (which is the date on the article)... and they already scrapped the idea.

Nice try though :D
http://www.factcheck.org/askfactcheck/did_obama_accuse_veterans_of_selfishness_and.html

As reported by the Washington Post and others including Fox News, the Obama administration met with several veterans groups on March 16 and floated the idea of saving taxpayers $540 million by billing veterans' private insurance companies for treatment of conditions connected to their military service, including war injuries. The Department of Veterans Affairs currently bills these insurance companies for treatment of non-service-related conditions.

But as administration officials made clear at the time, there was no proposal to force veterans to pay for treatment for their own injuries, or to make them buy private insurance if they did not already have it. In fact, administration officials told FactCheck.org at the time that their proposal would have no financial impact on veterans at all.

"The idea ... would result in no additional out-of-pocket costs to veterans even when their private insurance plans require deductibles before benefits are paid," one official told us in an exchange of e-mails.

Nevertheless, veterans organizations protested. An American Legion news release carried the headline: "The American Legion Strongly Opposed to President's Plan to Charge Wounded Heroes for Treatment." It complained that the idea could under some circumstances result in added costs to veterans despite administration officials' assurances. For example, the Legion said, a veteran's treatment might cost enough to reach maximum insurance coverage limits, leaving the rest of the veteran's family without health care benefits.

Two days after its meeting with veterans groups, the White House released a formal announcement saying that "the President has instructed that [the idea's] consideration be dropped."
 

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Discussion Starter #3
ok; sorry...i just got it an email today...along with some other things I didn't think will true but I'll add it here and let you guys dicfer it.
i'm not following this stuff much these days...i am choosing to put head in sand as what i hear gets my bp up too much!:D

here is "the rest of the story"....supposedly: not my words...i didn't check anything; this is just part of the email......


OBAMA IS SURPRISED
I checked this out on "truth or fiction" and it is truth , but the proposal was withdrawn after Sen. Akaka, democratic chairman of the veteran affairs committee refused to let it out of the committee. The president then withdrew the plan.
*******************
HERE IS HIS RESPONSE WHEN HE BACKED OFF FROM HIS DECISION TO LET THE MILITARY PA Y FOR THEIR WAR INJURIES….SEND THIS TO EVERYONE TO SHOW JUST WHAT HE THINKS OF OUR MILITARY WHO FIGHT FOR OUR COUNTRY AND GET HURT PROTECTING OUR FREEDOM!!!
Bad press, including major mockery of the plan by comedian Jon Stewart, led to President Obama abandoning his proposal to require veterans carry private health insurance to cover the estimated $540 million annual cost to the federal government of treatment for injuries to military personnel received during their tours on active duty. The President admitted that he was puzzled by the magnitude of the opposition to his proposal. "Look, it's an all volunteer force," Obama complained… =0 A
"Nobody made these guys go to war. They had to have known and accepted the risks. Now they whine about bearing the costs of their choice? It doesn't compute...”
"I thought these were people who were proud to sacrifice for their country," Obama continued. "I wasn't asking for blood, just money. With the country facing the worst financial crisis in its history, I'd have thought that the patriotic thing to do would be to try to help reduce the nation's deficit. I guess I underestimated the selfishness of some of my fellow Americans."
 

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Please read my link... those are NOT real quotes of the Obama administration.

Made-up Quotes

To start, the e-mail's anonymous author offers no evidence to substantiate the disparaging remarks about veterans that he or she attributes to President Obama. White House spokesman Tommy Vietor told us that "these quotes are fabricated."

Our own research backs that up. We searched news databases and turned up no news organization that has ever quoted Obama this way. We conclude that these quotes are simply made-up, and perhaps intended as satire.
I encourage EVERYONE to go to snoopes.com and factcheck.org any time they receive one of those chain emails.
 

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Actually the fact that he considered it--which the Snopes link says that he did--and only scrapped it when such outrage was expressed, speaks volumes to me.
 

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Actually the fact that he considered it--which the Snopes link says that he did--and only scrapped it when such outrage was expressed, speaks volumes to me.
Because you understand that the private health insurance market is a disaster and that a single payer is the only reasonable option?

BTW, I agree that it was a politically idiotic idea. What I don't understand is why people want to subject the rest of us to the horrors of the current health insurance system.
 

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Because you understand that the private health insurance market is a disaster and that a single payer is the only reasonable option?

Had to take my neighbor to the VA the other morning for an emergency related to a service related injury, you think the private system is Smurfed up, you should see that one.
 

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Had to take my neighbor to the VA the other morning for an emergency related to a service related injury, you think the private system is Smurfed up, you should see that one.
So your single trip to the VA hospital is evidence of the quality of care at VA hospitals in general. I see.

Or is your point that veterans *should* be cared for through private insurance? I'm confused.
 

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So your single trip to the VA hospital is evidence of the quality of care at VA hospitals in general. I see.

The fact that one trip was that smurfed up scares the hell out of me. And most Vets I've know have told me about dealing with some of the same ****, including my late Dad.

It's just that last week I got to see it for real.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
aren't VA hospitals government run?

and having a soldier PAY for that ... bad, bad idea!

I still say put all the federal employees (that includes politicians) on the EXACT same plan they are suggesting for the rest of us and then we will see what ideas they come up with that will really work.
 

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aren't VA hospitals government run?
Yep they are. among the things I seen that day was they had to transfer him to Omaha by ambulance but told him he'd have to pay for that, till he raised hell and 3 phone calls later they decided that since it was service related tet would pay for the ambulance.

BTW the VA hospital at Lincoln has an emergency room that don't open till 8 am.:rolleyes:
 

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I still say put all the federal employees (that includes politicians) on the EXACT same plan they are suggesting for the rest of us and then we will see what ideas they come up with that will really work.
Well, they're not suggesting A plan for anyone. There will be a lot of options. But I do think it would be a great idea to have a public plan at least for all federal employees. But that would be decried as socialistic and wouldn't happen.
 

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Because you understand that the private health insurance market is a disaster and that a single payer is the only reasonable option?
Because I believe that if a soldier is injured protecting the rest of us, then WE should pay for his health care.

And BTW I like my insurance plan just fine. And I don't want the O administration telling me what type of insurance I can have. Or what type of medical treatment I can have.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
I want the same plan the feds get...and the congress and the senate and the prez's family...I figure that would be the best for all of us! :)
 

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And I don't want the O administration telling me what type of insurance I can have. Or what type of medical treatment I can have.
Your insurance company is no better or worse than the Obama administration bureaucrats. It will place itself between you and your doctor and will definitely ration your care just the same if it's in their interest to do so. I suspect most understand that for-profit healthcare has just as many negative aspects as a purely government run system. Can we at least agree that *something* ought to be done?

I am also unsure of the moral implications of continuing to have close to 50 million people without health insurance in this country. It's just not like that in the rest of the developed world. We've gotta do better.
 

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My husband IS a veteran. He relies entirely upon the VA for his medical care. Mark is also extremely involved in several veterans interest groups (both state and nationwide.) VA hospitals, in general, are getting very high marks from the vets he works with.

Yes. There, I said it. High marks.

From dental, to eye care, to general medical care, to emergency care. The general consensus is that the VA is now (finally) giving good medical care to the veterans.

Let me tell you, Mark would be the FIRST to be critical of the care he or one of his fellow veterans received. He would be first in line to sing it from the rooftops.

Instead, he tells stories of Vietnam veterans across the country who finally feel that they are receiving excellent medical care. No comparison to the medical care he and his comrades received in the 70s, when they returned home after fighting a worthless battle.

Now, of course, your results may vary. A vet might have great results 9 out of 10 times. But, is that really any different then the medical care given to consumers in the public sector?

Oh, and by the way. If your VA hospital's emergency room is not open 24 hours a day, he/she is encouraged to go to a public hospital. The one caveat? He/she must call (or have someone call) their VA hospital to let them know where they are.
 

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Your insurance company is no better or worse than the Obama administration bureaucrats. It will place itself between you and your doctor and will definitely ration your care just the same if it's in their interest to do so. I suspect most understand that for-profit healthcare has just as many negative aspects as a purely government run system. Can we at least agree that *something* ought to be done?

I am also unsure of the moral implications of continuing to have close to 50 million people without health insurance in this country. It's just not like that in the rest of the developed world. We've gotta do better.
I agree, but I understand the resistance to reform. It's the moral hazard of our current system. MANY individuals are happy with their current care. They do not directly bear the costs--their employers do--they do not see the aggregate costs (in dollars and misery) of having so many uninsured. And they do not bear current responsibility for the the coming explosion in insurance and entitlement costs that will bankrupt us all unless we massively transform how healthcare is managed, delivered, and paid for.
 

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I want the same plan the feds get...and the congress and the senate and the prez's family...I figure that would be the best for all of us! :)
I agree entirely. Forget the Congress, I am just a very (and I mean very) junior attorney and I think the system is fantastic.

I think the "healthcare exchange" concept is supposed to mimic the program we have as federal employees.
 
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