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Discussion Starter #1
for a first time breeding is natural the way to go or AI okay?

Another forum I visit says using AI the first time gives no indication the dog is willing to breed and without the sex drive the dog should not be bred. I have seen some stud dog ads say they only do AI stud service. If you found a dog you adore and like what he produces and think it will improve your bitches fault, but for a first time would you go to another dog for a live breeding? I have noticed some first time bitches are bred to the breeders stud on site, is that because of this or do you think they bought the ***** to complement the stud.
 

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Our first breeding was AI. Stud was in MI, we are in CO. There was no other way. I would never compromise my choice to pick just to avoid doing an AI. I almost did that, and boy am I glad I changed my mind.

I was talking to a gal who is wanting to breed her girl and we were talking about this very thing. IMHO, if you are using a stud owned by a seasoned breeder and they allow natural, most the times you take your girl up there that middle week and they take care of the process.

Even with a local stud, I think I would prefer AI. You do your progesterone tests, you know when to breed the *****. Then you do the collection and AI right there.

Some breeders will use their own studs, though you have to be careful about it. My mentor bought a new boy from a great pedigree that complemented her pedigree and just recently had pups (she did a side by side AI). But that's a question that you'd need to ask to breeder about because many times BYB's or not-so-hot breeders will soley use their own boys because they won't have to pay a stud fee. They usually don't give a crap about pedigree, just want to crank out pups. That's why you need to ask why they chose the stud they did.
 

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In show bred labradors, I would hazard to say that most breed only by AI even if the stud is right there, it's safer and less time consuming for everyone involved. I don't think we are running any sort of risk in producing dogs without sex drive... my girls have been used as teases when in season, and they're well lets just say very into it, and my boys are more than willing to breed something if allowed. A breeder who keeps boys will often use them on their own bitches (or allow friends to use him) so they know what he produces.
 

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I often wonder if there was anything to the AI & Natural breedings we did with my boy.
Both naturals to the same ***** resulted in over 10 pups each. The AI's were less than 5.
Lily's first litter was an AI but she has 6. Her mom has very good sized litters...of course they were AI's.... so I am just rambling here LOL
 

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I wonder that too. Know quite a few people with small litters lately. I did an AI in 06 and had 7 pups. Did another (different girl but both maidens) in 08 and had a singleton (with resorped pups).

Recently did a surgical AI so we shall see what happens.

Know someone that just had a litter of 11 with a side by side AI.

I know from a consult with Hutch that he is scratching his head over the amount of singletons he has seen lately.
 

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Lily's was a side by side AI but still was small. Six but one was stillborn. All but one was born already outside the sac and I think #6 was just out of the sac for too long but she was also SUPER small and I doubt she would have lived. Five was a good number but six would have been great.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
...this might get off track but is it better to have a larger litter when choosing out show quality, or will a small litter give you the same amount of chances for a nice dog.

I talked to a boston terrier breeder at the weekend show and they usually have small litters, three or four pups. So if breeder keeps one, friend of breeder keeps one, then I wonder what is left. :confused:
 

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Its always nice for the breeder to have more to choose from. But there are no guarantees, no matter what the size of the litter, that there will be a show potential pup in the litter.

You choose the stud to compliment your ***** and hope and pray you have a keeper.
 

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I rarely do a natural breeding with Seamus. My mentor's #1 Labrador in the country went sterile after breeding a ***** with a low grade infection. Most breeders I know all do AI.

He's got drive and I let him tease and play with the ***** and when he's ready to mount, I collect him.

As with any breeding, timing is everything whether you're doing a natural or an AI.
 

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...this might get off track but is it better to have a larger litter when choosing out show quality, or will a small litter give you the same amount of chances for a nice dog.
Breedings a crap shoot. My litter of two are both still here and I'm more than happy with them (Ditto and Spielberg). I know of a couple one and two puppy litters that were very nice. On the flip side, I know of large litters where nothing was worth keeping (for the show ring). It's always nice to have a bunch to choose from, but when it comes down to it, you only need one ;)
 

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With Belle, I did an AI from Texas. She had 7 pups, and ALL could have gone on to extremely successful performance/conformation homes. Kodi will be similar, whatever stud I pick for her. I do not care what the size of the litter, I care about where they will go and how "perfect" their home will be. (i.e. I want the pups to be sold before the litter is is bred and to performance homes that will do conformation, if the pup is "worthy"
 

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So much can happen with the semen too, if its been collected, extended and shipped. For example, my Ruby's first breeding arrived as a tube of frozen semen, when it shouldn't have...

Two side by side AI's six months later yielded 10 puppies from an 11 year old stud dog.

Given timing, and quality of semen and health and character of the *****, I was told everyone should have 10 puppy litters. If not, timing was off, or semen was off, ***** may have had a small infection, or may have been stressed...or heck, it just didn't happen.
 

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Discussion Starter #16 (Edited)
Two side by side AI's six months later yielded 10 puppies from an 11 year old stud dog.
WOW!!!

Hmmm, this have been very educational. I guess AI is what is becoming common. Does anyone think this may lead to problems with the dog breed as a whole if we end up doing only AI in future...I know some dogs for whatever reasons won't breed naturally with what the breeder has picked, so doing an AI has made it possible. Sometimes I wonder if we mess with nature too much we might regret it. As Labby explained her dog has plenty of sex drive but I wonder if when a ***** won't allow a dog to breed with her if it is nature trying to say it shouldn't be done. (is this off topic again? ...but it is my tread :D)

Edited to add: I watched an oprah segment a couple weeks ago about people being attracted to the opposite sex but it said smell actually comes into play. If you are turned off by how the person smells it is natures way of saying you shouldn't make babies (or something to that effect). Dogs have a much more stronger sense of smell if a dog doesn't want to mate a certain dog it makes me curious. Many purebreds now are plagued by so many health issues and I guess I have been pushing around the idea of breeding with my small dog but the health issues in her breed make me nervous. So I have been reading alot about health issues and how breeders and science are trying to fix it. Rottweiler as a breed have been testing for HD for over thirty years but still HD is prevelant and cancer is a huge killer in the breed. I have noticed Linebreeding is very popular as well. Labradors as a whole seem a very healthy breed. Even my byb puppymill boy hasn't had any issues with his health. I just wonder if anyone else is questioning our sudden reliance on AI and if it might effect breeds in future for worse.

I also feel AI have been great in allowing dogs at great distance to be able to breed also older great males or already dead males can now add to the gene pool. and that I think is good.
 
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