Katie's limp

[naomi]

My 9month old black lab Katie, had her xray yesterday. She has had a limp on and off for several months and anti inflamatory medication was not working. Good news is that her xray (front leg) showed no damage or deformity of the bone and joints. However, the vet wants to refer her to an orthapaedic specialist in case more can be seen from the xray, also she may need an exploratory operation, as apparently shoulder displaysia cant always be seen on an xray.

Poor little girl was without her mum (me!) for most of the day and although still a bit doppey when we collected her, she wagged her tail as much as she could! She also had severe diarroeah during the night, which was probably after effects of the anasthetic.

[Brigettas Mom]

Poor baby. Good thoughts that the x-rays the specialist takes are clear too.

[naomi]

Thank you. This forum is so supportive, so glad I found it! Who would have thought a forum just for labs. Cant go on very often but will try to become a regular.

[Tatyana]

I think taking her to an orthopaedic vet is a great idea. You should be thanking your regular vet for making that suggestion.

My Lab, Scotty, has elbow dysplasia. His regular vet could not see anything wrong on the x-rays. I think his regular vet is wonderful but not trained specifically for orthopaedic issues. I had Scotty's x-rays sent to a radiologist in Colorado who immediately saw a problem (on the same set of x-rays!!!). Then, I took Scotty to an orthopaedic vet who recommended bilateral orthroscopic surgery. There are two types of elbow dysplasia: FCP (fractured coronoid process) and UAP (ununited anconeal process), which means that pieces of the bone chip off and cause discomfort (thus limping) and damage to the cartliage. It is almost impossible to see these bone fragments on the x-rays, thus the recommendation for the exploratory surgery.

There can be another explanation for your dog's limping--panosteitis. Hopefully, that is what your puppy has. Pano is otherwise known as growth pains and goes away eventually.

I hope you do go and see the ortho vet and hope he has good news for you. If it's more serious than pano, please come back and let us know. There are several of us here with dogs with elbow problems. I would have been a complete wreck without the support of the people here when we were going through this whole thing.

[Paola]

There are two types of elbow dysplasia: FCP (fractured coronoid process) and UAP (ununited anconeal process), which means that pieces of the bone chip off and cause discomfort (thus limping) and damage to the cartliage. It is almost impossible to see these bone fragments on the x-rays, thus the recommendation for the exploratory surgery.

Actually there are 4 different types of elbow dysplasia - besides the ones you mentioned there is OCD (ostheo chondrosis dissecans) and Inc (joint incongruity). If Xrays are done properly, 90% of times they can be diagnosed from the Xrays.
My personal choice, and I know a few breeders agree, wouldn't be surgery straight off. Supplements, conservative management and appropriate non stressful exercise often allow the problem to subside on its own in young dogs. Unless limping is severe and impacts quality of life, conservative management might work as well. The success rate of these surgeries is about 50% and the issues can re-occur; so surgery often doesn't make a big difference.

Btw - the limping could just be caused by a pulled muscle. Not uncommon and it often takes longer to resolve than other things.

[Canyon Labradors]

My personal choice, and I know a few breeders agree, wouldn't be surgery straight off. Supplements, conservative management and appropriate non stressful exercise often allow the problem to subside on its own in young dogs. Unless limping is severe and impacts quality of life, conservative management might work as well. The success rate of these surgeries is about 50% and the issues can re-occur; so surgery often doesn't make a big difference.

BTW-I don't believe that this course of treatment is really good for FCP. Maddy had that and when the bone fragments off, it's in the joint and grinds away the cartilage. The longer you wait, the more damage you incurr in the joint. For FCP, it's best you treat it right away. Most cases, surgery. At least based on what I learned when Maddy had it, that's my feeling.

[Tatyana]

BTW-I don't believe that this course of treatment is really good for FCP. Maddy had that and when the bone fragments off, it's in the joint and grinds away the cartilage. The longer you wait, the more damage you incurr in the joint. For FCP, it's best you treat it right away. Most cases, surgery. At least based on what I learned when Maddy had it, that's my feeling.

I have to agree with this. It was a hard decision for me to have surgery done on Scotty, but after a second opinion and several discussions with Scotty's breeder, we decided it was the best way. He had fragments already in his elbows by the time the surgery was done. The fragments did not show up on the x-rays; he was diagnosed with Grade II elbow dysplasia based on the x-rays, so yes, correctly taken x-rays will give you the right diagnosis; but fragments are not likely to show up on the film (I don't remember about the CAT scan; I think Jazz had a CAT scan, but I don't remember is they were able to see fragments even then).

I asked Scotty's ortho about the common understanding that surgery of this type was unsuccessful. He said that a lot of the statistics are based on pre-orthroscopic surgeries. He said that orthroscopic surgery does not damage the joint as much as an open surgery. After weighing are options carefully, we went with the surgery.

I hope that the original poster will come back and let us know what the ortho vet said. You can always send the puppy's x-rays to the OFA for a preliminary evaluation. Dr. Keller does all elbow prelims, and you can talk to him on the phone. He is very nice, and his advice gave me the peace of mind that I needed in choosing what to do about my dog's elbow issues.

[Paola]

BTW-I don't believe that this course of treatment is really good for FCP.* Maddy had that and when the bone fragments off, it's in the joint and grinds away the cartilage.* The longer you wait, the more damage you incurr in the joint.* For FCP, it's best you treat it right away.* Most cases, surgery.* At least based on what I learned when Maddy had it, that's my feeling.

It's an educated guess. I know some who didn't do surgery and treated conservatively (and with joint support) and are doing better than others who have had surgery.
My surgeon (who has been doing arthroscopic surgery for years) quotes the sucess rate at 30-50%. Doesn't matter what type. I think the discriminating factor are the symptoms - if they really impact quality of life, surgery is the only option. If it's occasional limping, I'm not sure I'd mess around in there as a first choice.

Btw - ACV does break down the sedimentation, if used consistently. It's cheap, easy to find and is also good for a whole lot of issues. If you have a dog with a history of joint issues, I'd try using it.

[Askillaun]

My 9month old black lab Katie, had her xray yesterday. She has had a limp on and off for several months and anti inflamatory medication was not working. Good news is that her xray (front leg) showed no damage or deformity of the bone and joints. However, the vet wants to refer her to an orthapaedic specialist in case more can be seen from the xray, also she may need an exploratory operation, as apparently shoulder displaysia cant always be seen on an xray.

Poor little girl was without her mum (me!) for most of the day and although still a bit doppey when we collected her, she wagged her tail as much as she could! She also had severe diarroeah during the night, which was probably after effects of the anasthetic.

My darling Rocky - a seven month chocolate lab seems (nearly certain) to have elbow displaysia - referred to a surgeon. I am so worried and read the posts with interest - but some time has passed since the original postings and I wondered how things have gone since the operation please?

I am sure you all know how upset us 'soppy' owners get . . . so any good news is more than welcome. Thanks so much.

[LuvBrown]

Maybe you should open a new thread instead of posting on one nearly 5 years old.